You are here
Eikaiwa Still in the Dumps
A new report by the Yano Research Institute shows that the language study market is still feeling the effects of Nova's collapse.
The report [354KB PDF], for FY2007, found that the entire language market (including peripheral businesses such as language testing, homestay intermediaries, and translation and interpretation) fell by 1.9% to ¥8.1 billion yen compared to the previous year. If these other peripheral businesses are excluded, the market declined 3.7% to ¥5.5 bilion.
The report cites the collapse of Nova and the consumer trouble related to the company as reasons for the decline.
The foreign language market alone shrunk by a whopping 61.7%. The numbers improves slightly to 41.7% if peripheral businesses are included.
Despite the decline, the report found that globalization of business drove demand for corporate language services. Other trends include more demand for English language materials for children, despite Japan's declining fertility rate, and strong demand for language software for portable game devices. Notably, the e-learning market grew by 12.8% to ¥2.8 billion, while the market for software for portable game devices grew 31.1% to ¥7.8 billion.
The market for English lessons for children increased 32.9% to ¥22.6 billion yen. However, YRI expects lower growth for this market due to the high cost of child care and the end of a building boom of new facilities that has taken place over the past five years.
YRI forecasts that the language market will ultimately grow as learning foreign languages is still important for businesses and the demand for English lessons for children remains as strong as ever. YRI expects the market to grow by 1%
Comment: So it seems that people are choosing to study at home with their mobile phone or Nintendo DS instead of signing up at a school. The Nintendo DS, in particular, is pretty strong in this category. Not only does it have a wide range of titles for brushing up on your kanji and grammar, its titles for learning English, such as Eigo zuke, are quite good. I can't say I blame students for staying away. There are numerous advantages: low cost, no pressure sales, no contracts, no need to book lessons, the list goes on.
Comments
This report is about fiscal 2007, and not "the period from April to June 2008."
It's really no surprise that the eikaiwa numbers fell in 2007, seeing as how that's the year NOVA failed. This report actually predicts small INCREASES in eikaiwa business for 2008. The picture painted here is not as bleak as Shawn makes it out to be.
The virtual explosion in pre-school English lessons is a case in point. This bodes extremely well for the 'industry' on the whole, and is clearly big news in the report. But Shawn closes his post with comments about people choosing to study by Nintendo DS and their mobile phones. Yes, the report does mention that, but... Even with huge growth in these sectors, they still total only 1.5% of the money generated by eikaiwa schools, even in a declining market! At the current rate of growth we can talk about e-learning overtaking eikaiwa schools in about another decade. And of course, growth in those fields will slow dramatically within a couple of years.
Shawn is clearly the most embittered ex-eikaiwa teacher in the world. The thought that eikaiwa is not going to fall of the face of the planet within his lifetime seems to irk him to no end.
Thanks for catching that error.
I'm bitter?
Shawn
Most definitely, the market-- especially for adults (long the mainstay of NOVA)-- is shrinking drastically. Japanese adults at least have learned what gaijin have known all along-- you can become fairly fluent through self-study via good programs (CD-ROM, Nintendo DS, etc.). Strictly through self-study at home I became an intermediate speaker of Japanese within a year. As a result of discretionary income belt-tightening, Japanese are learning you don't need an overpriced eikaiwa with its fees, membership charges, overpriced texts, etc. to take on English.
How long did people honestly expect the circus act of eikaiwa to go on for?
Can you imagine paying through the nose in your home country, for the privilege of sitting with a Japanese puppy straight of university, unable to speak English, not qualified to teach a second or foreign language, with 2 or 3 days in-house training under his/her belt, who essentially does listen and repeat exercises with you from the word’s shittiest in-house text book?
Japan, when it was flush with disposable income, used to have an insatiable curiosity about foreigners, but those days are long gone. Japan is no longer a gaigin virgin is the main point, but in addition, the economy just can't asborb blatant waste of hard earned yen like it used to be able to.
Now, now they want value for money, and the whole gaigin play thing is no longer fashionable, well, at least not on the scale that is used to be.
It is sad for those looking for an easy ride, that gaigin play thing no longer has rock star status, but only the very best of bands keep their audience for eternity. Kid out of fresh out of school, grinning away while reading from a book, has lost its appeal, finally. What a surprise, not.
ah...glad i dont have to do this anymore..
http://www.grapheine.com/bombaytv/index.php?module=see&lang=uk&code=3169...
Looks more like the Voice room of my dreams! What a bunch of sad fucks they were!
its sad? for those looking for an easy ride? why would they care? they dont care about their students, they dont really care about this country. they will just uproot as easily as they did to come here and go elsewhere, which is good for the rest of us who want to teach properly.
Give me a break. Most people teaching in Japan do it for the experience, girls, money or whatever. English teachers are not on any kind of mission to make the world a better place. If they are, teaching English in Japan is about the least effective way to do it.
Face reality. A trained monkey could teach most English lessons in Japan. There is usually very little difference between the quality of a lesson taught by someone out to make a buck or a crusader. An English teacher is just an employee that the student expects a service from. Not that much different than your neighborhood 711 worker.
Yeah, that’s right, if you don’t do the booth monkey job for your eikaiwa slave master to the best of your ability, you don’t care about the students, and you don’t care about Japan. Yeah, right.
The way to show you are committed to Japan is to plant your roots deeply, in the corridors of eikaiwa, and give it your heartfelt best, and teach properly (regardless of having no tools or qualifications to do so, no proper training, and a schedule the rest of the world laughs at). Yeah, right.
Listen you wet behind the ears ding bat, eikaiwa was originally supported by the Japanese government simply to encourage international exchange. That’s it. Nothing more, nothing less.
The official view was always that is was a part-time kiddie job at the best, and work conditions and hours used to reflect that, as did the lack of need for any social security. Hours, for the same money as today, used to be about 20 hours per week, tops, and that was enough hours, for being a pretend teacher/entertainer, which is pretty mind numbing stuff, ALL agreed, including the Japanese government, the employers, and the employees.
It was simply a way for young foreigners to come and enjoy Japan, and a way for the shy Japanese to come in off the streets into the cubicles, and say hi. All good for Japan's greater international image. Everyone happy.
That was all until rotten to the very core and crimminally minded NOVA came along, of course, and scammed, fleeced, and butchered the entire industry – ripping off all in their path – the Japanese government, the customers and the employees.
Now, well now eikaiwa is just a soul destroying, mind numbing ride in a slave trader's boat. Being a play time thing for the ever so cute and curious Japanese was fine for a few hours a day (especially considering the lack of workers rights that went with the part-time entertainer package offered by eikaiwa), but as a full time job or career, still with none of the trimmings?
Please, you have to be joking.
Just hang out in Japan at little longer. You will wake up, like most people do.
END OF
Quotations?
Citations?
"A trained monkey could teach most English lessons in Japan."
Evidence? When did the experiment take place?
"There is usually very little difference between the quality of a lesson taught by someone out to make a buck or a crusader."
Again, on what evidence are you drawing your conclusion?
"Most people teaching in Japan do it for the experience, girls, money or whatever."
Yeah, and most Germans are Nazis.
Your generalistic rant doesn't cut the mustard, I'm afraid, with anyone who used their education, to develop their reasoning skills. Go back to school.
"How long did people honestly expect the circus act of eikaiwa to go on for? "
Quite alot longer, actually, now that Ye Olde Nova has crashed. Perhaps indefinitely. No more will one shiity company suck up all the money and the action, stamping out the fun, along the way. And students and teachers can return to the days when English Convo classes were easygoing, interesting, and, dammit, sometimes even educational.
I also.... oh, hang on a minute, I'll just move this piece of paper - oh, it's my last month's payslip - 355,000 yen....
What was that again...?
A bit sensitive here aren't we!
The simple fact is that teaching English in Japan does NOT require any specialized training. All that is required is:
1. native English speaker
2. be able to read and write
Having a little bit of personality, nice tits etc. certainly helps too, but that does not change the fact that English teaching in Japan is basically unskilled labor. Following a lesson plan from a book or making one yourself is not going to make that much of a difference. Simple FACTS! Get down off your high horse and get used to it!
that most University teaching jobs require a Masters' Degree, which excludes 90% of the Native English speaking population from applying:
http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_percentage_of_the_US_population_has_a_master's_degree
Answer that, and stay fashionable.
I think you'll find you can't.
But I would know that, wouldn't I, as I did a Masters Degree.
Like I said, going back to school teaches you all kinds of stuff, and opens doors you couldn't open before, or maybe didn't even know were there.
I own neither tits, nor a high horse, but I do own a Masters degree, in EFL, and it has come in rather handy, in Japan!
Anyway, back to my McUniversity McTeaching Mcjob, with complimentary McPC... so I can reply to Mcpeople like Mcyou, any Mctime.
Have a nice McDay,
McLes....
I know you cant get enough of these!
http://www.grapheine.com/bombaytv/index.php?module=see&lang=uk&code=b56a...
the hits just keep on coming!
http://www.grapheine.com/bombaytv/index.php?module=see&lang=uk&code=6a26...
Feisty, I like that! Too bad you don’t have nice tits!
Too bad all your education did not teach you how to follow the points of a message though. My point were that teaching English, as it is usually done in Japan anyway, is basically unskilled labor, that there is not much difference in the lessons between those who take it seriously or not and that English teaching in Japan is something most do not take so seriously (for good reason in my humble opinion).
Listing your supposed achievements had nothing to do with my points and only made you look rather defensive. Anyway, I think most would say getting a masters degree is a bit of an achievement. Teaching English in Japan will not get you much respect though.
Now, chill and work on those titties!!
Please, stop coming back at me each time, trying to dress up your own opinions as truisms. Because unless they are true, which has not been the case up to now, I will happily prove you wrong. I only deal in facts.
You're obviously not thinking straight. Drunk? Fevered ego getting in the way? Or just bad powers of recall? My guess is that you're just one of those people who has to get the last word, even if you make a complete berk of yourself in the process.
Just to be absolutely crystal clear, I'll quote your previous post:
Ahem:
"The simple fact is that teaching English in Japan does NOT require any specialized training. All that is required is:
1. native English speaker
2. be able to read and write"
Well, the simple fact is, that PLENTY of teaching jobs in Japan require specialised training. Just because YOU don't move in such circles doesn't make this fact any less true. You might not be aware of this, but there are institutions, and companies, the British Council for one, that will ONLY accept applications from qualified EFL teachers. If you do not believe me, call or write to the British Council, in Tokyo, Kyoto, or Osaka. Tell them you have no teaching qualifications, and ask them for a job.
You can't move the goalposts, by writing subsequent posts, that temper your previous ones, by inserting words like "usually" and "most", AFTER you have been proved wrong.
You have NO idea what you're talking about. Please go away, and have an argument with a tree, or something, because you're clearly out of your league, trying to mix it with animate objects.
True, unfortunately for teaching English in Japan all is required is being a native English speaker and being able to read and write. However, at the end this job, like any other job, can be performed well or badly depending on the person who's doing it. I have seen many teachers teaching shitty lessons, but I have also seen some going the extra mile, adapting poorly designed lessons by adding extra material or changing the way they were structured to make them better and more educational. A good teacher is a good teacher at NOVA, Gaba, AEON or any other school because he/she can't work in any other way. Delivering poor lessons with the excuse that the job is "unskilled" or many other people do the same is really sad. I met quite a few people like that, they now moved on to other jobs and they have the same problems. If you ask them why they don't work properly and are often late they'll reply "it's because the job is shit, the company is shit" and so on. So, it's not the job that is "unskilled" (teaching a language is a difficult and complex task), but are the people doing it that are unskilled. A solution to this would be for the Japanese government to require an official teaching qualification (CELTA/TEFL etc ...) as a condition to obtain a working visa. This would get rid of many "unskilled" teachers and the real ones would be able to get better deals.
A student I once knew, called Rie, bought Nova tickets, because she was told by staff, that all Nova teachers are qualified. Of course, she found out later that this was not true, was horrified, and then quit. So, you know, some people are in the dark.
Personally, I never tire of telling Japanese people that GABA, NOVA, etc happily hire unqualified teachers and then don't train them properly.
Sorry if this sounds a bit selfish, in regard to my fellow gaijins, but I'm just trying to raise the bar. Nothing personal. The last post was absolutely write - most of the people who slag teaching off can't actually teach.
They say that "those who can, do. And those who can't, teach". What a load of bollox, like "if you can remember the sixties, you weren't there".
Famous teachers:
Michelangelo
Aristotle
Confucius
Sting
Indiana Jones
Mrs Kraboppel
Ken Barlow
Bullit Baxter
Plain Jane, from Neighbours
Anyway, my point is that those who can, teach. Those who can't, become titled instructors.
Or something - I've had too much coffee. Complimentary coffee. Now you don't get that, at Nova and GABA!
I miss nova kids lessons!
http://www.grapheine.com/bombaytv/index.php?module=see&lang=uk&code=c0ba...
Its your day off..........chilling in Shinsaibashi.................
http://www.grapheine.com/bombaytv/index.php?module=see&lang=uk&code=55e9...
i think alan and dooley did..
First of all, CHILL OUT!
Oh, so now you are switching from talking about your educational background to saying (for the first time) that many ESL jobs in Japan require specialized training.
Well, you offer no evidence of this. Regardless of how many jobs like that there may be, that does not change the fact that the VAST MAJORITY of the English teaching jobs in Japan do NOT! That does NOTHING to change my point that anyone from an English speaking country with basic literacy could technically walk in and do most English teaching jobs in Japan with very little, if any, specialized training.
That is my point. Your educational level (whatever it may be)or what some jobs may require has virtually NOTHING to do with that point!
Well, not the point you wanna make, anyway.
"Oh, so now you are switching from talking about your educational background to saying (for the first time) that many ESL jobs in Japan require specialized training.
Well, you offer no evidence of this."
http://www.gaijinpot.com/c_ed.php#university - Check the "Qualifications" criteria
"Regardless of how many jobs like that there may be, that does not change the fact that the VAST MAJORITY of the English teaching jobs in Japan do NOT!"
OK. If you'd said "Vast majority" in the first place, and not:
"The simple fact is that teaching English in Japan does NOT require any specialized training. All that is required is:
1. native English speaker
2. be able to read and write"
maybe I wouldn't have had to blow you out of the water, and make you look foolish. But that's not my problem. I didn't go shooting my mouth off.
A simple fact is that most jobs in the world don't require any specialized training, either. If you want that kind of job, fine, and good luck. But don't tar everyone with the same brush.
"That is my point. Your educational level (whatever it may be)or what some jobs may require has virtually NOTHING to do with that point!"
YAWN
If I chilled out any more, mate, I'd be asleep. Your posts, are really, really tiresome. I have proved you wrong, won the argument, and dismantled your feeble generalisations. There is no way back. I'm not repeating myself. Even though, without the slightest justification, you accused me of not reading or understanding your points/posts, I read them and understood them entirely, which is more than you can say. And please stop saying "MY POINT" You haven't made any points - you just vacillate, in order to keep the argument going. Go and argue with someone else.
"The simple fact is that teaching English in Japan does NOT require any specialized training. All that is required is:
1. native English speaker
2. be able to read and write"
Les, you do need to chill out... Anon's quote could be true so long as there at least one English teaching job that doesn't require specialized training. There's absolutely no quantification in his/her statement and I can only assume that you have forgotten the basics of the mathematical logic course you took for your undergrad.
You're obviously highly sensitive about the subject and you do a good job picking a fight you're the ONLY one here that read what Anon said as entirely inclusive of all English teaching jobs. What's even more bizarre is that quoted you salary which is actually less than what some Nova teachers I knew got before the collapse!
You use a tremendous amount of absurdly rhetorical language that means absolutely nothing and quite frankly it's annoying that you rely on the sword of 'ad hominem' to fall on while you make your point.
"The simple fact is that teaching English in Japan does NOT require any specialized training. All that is required is:
1. native English speaker
2. be able to read and write"
"Les, you do need to chill out... Anon's quote could be true so long as there at least one English teaching job that doesn't require specialized training."
So now we've gone down from "teaching English in Japan does NOT require any specialized training"
to....
"Anon's quote could be true so long as there at least ONE English teaching job that doesn't require specialized training"
"What's even more bizarre is that quoted you salary which is actually less than what some Nova teachers I knew got before the collapse!"
Money ain't everything. My salary's good enough for me.
"You use a tremendous amount of absurdly rhetorical language that means absolutely nothing and quite frankly it's annoying that you rely on the sword of 'ad hominem' to fall on while you make your point."
It means absolutely nothing to you. While your language simply sings, in its clarity, and simplicity. NOT.
Have you noticed that I haven't tried to clarify ANY of my previous points?
They speak for themselves. No vacillating, between ALL, MOST, SOME, EVEN JUST ONE.
There are people, on these threads, who try and belittle my profession. While I have absolutely NO problem, with unqualified, inexperienced individuals, who want to come to Japan, just for the buzz, they are just ONE type of foreigner, here, in Japan.
So, forgive me, for not being CHILL enough.
That is a terrible wage for such qualifications.
I am uneducated and pull in double that. Don't have to wear a suit or tie either. No boss too.
I would say the above poster values his education more than his job.
good on him.
I guess everyone has their priorities.
I fully agree. There are tens of thousands of teachers worldwide with MAs who make only that or less. Teachers are generally under-rewarded. However, towards the end of their careers they will start to make more.
Teaching is supposed to be a vocation. It's not for everyone, it's a lifestyle choice.
jon
You are hilarious with your sensitivity! Now, PLEASE STOP TALKING ABOUT YOURSELF! That is NOT the point!
The point remains. The vast majority of English teaching in Japan requires very little if any specialized training and most ANY literate person from any English speaking country can do it. What some jobs may require does not change that fact either!
As long as English teaching in Japan remains basically unskilled/low skilled labor and most jobs offer little real chance for advancement, most people who come here to teach are not going to do it as a career. They are not going to take their work so seriously because there simply is no need to and doing so is not going to make much difference in most jobs regardless.
Again, this does not cover EVERY SINGLE job etc., but those are the basic facts-like them or not. You really need to take a chill pill or get some counseling (or some titties)!
The facts as the clued-in know them. 98% of 'teachers' in eikawai are here for one of these reasons (in order):
1) it's an easy job that allows plenty of partying time
2) romps with the opposite and/or same sex
3) a little cash to finance their Asian travels
4) nothing better turned up back home
If you have a pulse, are eligible for a visa (even better if you already have a work visa!) and don't resemble The Elephant Man TOO much, you'll get hired! So much for 'qualifications'.
These 98% know what's shakin' and go with the flow. The other 2% get offended and start screaming matches about how they really are teachers and they take it seriously... blah blah blah. For a recap, read points 1-4 above. I should know, I'm one of the 98% and I'm OK with that.
The above post By Ben Stein is correct. Most "Teachers" are here for really for those things mentioned above. Most of these people tend to stay for a year or less but there are of course people who are here for the long term.
Most "Teachers" over here don't see it as a career and those that do are better off getting proper qualifications and working in the University sector or even getting completely out of English teaching.
you vacillate, with every post, and have not provided one shred of evidence to back up your claims.
Your points and facts are nothing of the kind.
Les,
You're surely not trying to deny that there are a huge number of pointless foreign tossers, who have found sanctuary in Japan?
But, on the other hand, you are also right, that there are many highly skilled, successful, dynamic people, here, who do well, fit in, and really get something worthwhile, out of the Japan experience. I meet lots and lots of people like that, when I go to embassy bashes, etc.
But it's highly doubtful that the guy you are arguing with is one of those people, isn't it? Get a grip, Les.
Dear Ben. If you're part of that 98% who's here in Japan for the reasons you mentioned, fine. But, what's wrong with liking one's own job (the 2% who are trying to teach) and trying to do it properly?
BTW I'm not working for an eikaiwa.
There's nothing wrong at all with the 2% trying "to do it properly", as you say. In fact, I'm in the 98% and I still try to do my best and give quality lessons. We are in the eikawa industry, OK? Unless you have a Master's in TESOL or an RSA diploma, the person is probably not teaching English effectively or competently. THOSE are the true professionals and they don't teach at low-paying eikaiwa. We aid in the absorbtion of conversational English, that's it. And with the 3-day "training" that most schools provide (or none), we are borderline dangerous as real teachers.
How much would you pay for a Japanese language lesson from a 22-year-old Japanese, in his first job out of uni, with a degree in French literature with zero teaching experience and no linguistics/ESL background, to teach you Japanese? With the tables turned that puts it in perspective, doesn't it. Please say 'yes'.
Hilarious how you accuse someone of having no facts but then post something that does not even try to give any!
Just what in the world are your facts? Are you saying working at most of English teaching jobs in Japan require intensive training? Are you saying that most literate people from English speaking countries could NOT do the jobs if put into them? Why would that be??
Again, I am not speaking for 100% of the jobs. I cannot speak for 100% of any job or profession. It simply has been my experience in Japan that most English teaching (as it is done here anyway) does not require any special skills. Why is that so shocking for you?? That always seemed to be common knowledge among those I talked to teaching in Japan.
Sorry, I just cannot be bothered to go find and do studies to prove it to you in a statistical way (doubt you would accept the results even if I did). Besides, just pushing your buttons is more fun anyway!!
You know, this might surprise you, man, but there are people who can excel, in their professional life AND party, like its 1999. The two are not mutually exclusive.
I've seen the 2008 report, which was released by Yano recently (which is why the 2007 one is now available for free).
The 2008 report shows a slight upturn in the language education business, of about 2%.
Yes, thank you Ben, you are right. I study Japanese and I wouldn't pay 500 yen per hour for the type of teacher you describe. I'm surprised by the fact that many Japanese are still studying at eikaiwa schools, which are not even that cheap.
Sorry Ben, but just because you're prepared to accept crap conditions of service for an occasional shag and a bit of pocket money, doesn't mean that all eikaiwa teachers are like you. I am still constantly amazed by how many eikaiwa teachers constantly attack themselves, their job and their colleagues. I'll grant you that the industry has a lot to answer for, as do the "customers". But, in the 5 plus years I lived in Japan I met more hardworking, intelligent eikaiwa teachers than I met crap ones. Furthermore, almost all of them had a degree which is more than you can say for most fields. In the UK there are lots of teachers with normal degrees doing on the job training. These teachers have full-time salaries, holidays and status. The only difference between them and most of the ALTs - and, in many ways, eikaiwa teachers - in Japan is the country, money, conditions, holidays and training. Just because someone gets a bit more nookie, doesn't make less valuable as a worker, or less deserving of proper pay, conditions and respect.
From what I've heard lately about pay and conditions in standard eikaiwa jobs in Japan, you'd be better off working in a bar in the UK: at least you'd get to meet interesting people and you get free food and drink. The only reason I can see for staying in Japan at the moment is the experience. Unless you're really lucky in your job - or you're not in eikaiwa: career, money or quality of life can't be one.
LesDawson: You were spot on. You were right in your argument and right to defend real teachers.
Oh, and Shawn is one of the best things to happen to eikaiwa and foreigners in Japan since the Edo period, so show a bit of respect!
Yes, I too have met mostly wonderful people while here, more outside of NOVA-- what a collection point for alcoholics and social misfits! Be careful with your 'most people have university degrees' claim. NOVA, and now GABA, was notorious for hiring WHV 20-year-olds WITHOUT a degree. That said, they could be just as effective in eikaiwa teaching as those with a Masters. In all comes down to personality.
Moreover, just having a degree means jack shit. "Hi, my name's Bill, I have a Master's degree in biology. Let me teach you English!" It's a rare teacher in Japan with a BA or MA in ESL/ linguistics.
Eikaiwa shouldn't be a long-term goal for anyone. You'll find yourself virtually unemployable when you reach 45 and beyond. Then what? It's a stepping stone in life and a chance for fun and sightseeing while you're here. I would still encourage all eikaiwa teachers to work hard, give the best lessons they can (given the lack of real training to do so) and just be a responsibile visitor.
Cheers, Baka Mike.
Anyway, I'd better produce some figures, for my Anonymous Nemesis:
From:
http://www.jref.com/society/foreigners_in_japan.shtml
Westerners living in Japan
In 2003, there were about 136,000 Western residents in Japan, including 60,000 North Americans, 51,000 Europeans (excluding Russia), 11,500 Australians, 4,000 New Zealanders and 3,700 Argentinians.
US citizens are by far the more numerous (48,000), although they only represent 2.5% of the total foreign population of Japan. Then come the British (18,000), Canadians (12,000), Australians (11,500), French (6,600) and Germans (4,900).
All Westerners in Japan only make up 0.01% of the Japanese population. However, 37% of the Westerners are to be found in Tokyo-to alone.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Nova employed about 5,000 teachers, at its peak. The other big Eikaiwa, combined probably employ 10,000 teachers max - and that is a generous estimate.
To be absolutely clear, once again. If you just come to Japan, for the buzz, fine, and good luck. But you belong to a small group of people, even among the small western population - perhaps 10 percent.
Anyway, best wishes, and no hard feelings. I enjoyed jousting with you, having my buttons pressed, etc. and would like to thank you, in advance, for being a gracious loser. Lets have a beer sometime.
"Most people teaching in Japan do it for the experience, girls, money or whatever."
Cite proof.
CAN YOU BELIEVE ITS BEEN A YEAR???
HAHAHHAHA!...ugh...
what a farce...i spent some time with an old buddy yesterday..and we STILL were talking about the shit..SO ridiculous..it REALLY was like the Bunker in Berlin...
can you imagine all the generals sitting around with the Soviet shells bursting over their heads...did it finally dawn on them WHY the fuck we did all this?..all of it was just for SHIT..for nothing..all the effort..
allthe killing..all the fighting..all hte destruction..the lives ruined..for nothing..
for Nova..all the serious serious corporate intrigue and Machiavellian twists..all the abuse of staff, students and teachers...to what end? (all the colouring of cards!...all that stapling and shredding!..for nothing!)
at my school...towards the end..we got to store all the crap from the other schools that had closed..and in one delivery of junk...there was a book about the fall of Berlin...it was so crazy-appropiate...you would swear there was a higher power at work. (i kept it)
what pisses me off is that i cannot let go of it myself..talking about the lives of edo fatler, and chari, (the big-titted, but inherently evil cunt, god i wanted to bang her!..hear that Gavin?..your wife is HOT..i want to fire a rope of jizz across her face! even though shes a glue-head..and FUCK YOU for becoming a corporate cunt!..you used to be decent...Naheen..Liam..all you fuckers) drunken crazy Limey wack-job Yvonne, robotic Adam...fascist Glenn and Michael..talking about them lends them and their bullshit corporate/high school attitudes legitimacy...a legitimacy that they should never get...
i am SO much happier with assholes like them out of my life..
you have to see it for what it is..and for what they are...a great lesson that took me a long time to get..but one which, fortunately, many people got earlier in their lives..and i hope they remember it...work is bullshit..dont take anything at work seriously...people who are your bosses are morons..dont be a cunt to people...dont give your loyalty to businesses..its just a simple trade, your time for their money...dont get attached to your job..dont define yourself by it...dont take their bullshit..dont get intimidated.
i am so ashamed to say i worked for Nova..so ashamed that i let them intimidate me cuz i didnt want to get sent home..i didnt want them to refuse me my next contract (no raise..11 months of "youre great"..one month of "you suck"..always at contract time)...i was afraid..afraid of seeing what else is out there..
the best time at nova was when it all went down..we all felt free at last..we all realized that yes we HAD to find new work, but not just yet....we sat around..getting pizza..wore t-shirts on a wednesday in Nagai park..just felt as if a burden had been lifted...we were HAPPY at last!..we laughed and laughed!!! we danced on the last day (the J-Staff were upset..but, they would be OK too). in the time we were looking, we didnt fall apart..we didnt "kill ourselves"..we got to be better people..we got much better jobs..we didnt starve..we adapted..we overcame..we won.
many of you were never worried that you would keep it together...bully for you..youre a better man than I Gunga Din...
some of us needed this lesson..i did..
A little long...my attention kinda wavered towards the end of the second sentence. Only kidding. Very interesting - enjoyed reading it.
Glad you found something else out there... I knew a couple of people, who even years ago, saw it for what it was and got out.
"work is bullshit..dont take anything at work seriously...people who are your bosses are morons..dont be a cunt to people...dont give your loyalty to businesses..its just a simple trade, your time for their money...dont get attached to your job..dont define yourself by it...dont take their bullshit..dont get intimidated"
I was told someting similar, years ago. Yep, we had a really cool careers advisor, back in Junior High. Heh heh.
Canadajin: nice post, a little heavy on the bitterness, but I understand. I watched 'the Fall of Berlin' myself; Fuhrer Saruhashi just needed a Luger . Still, you made a lot of valid points!
Were Gavin and Chari married? What is/are their last names(s)? I work with a Gavin now at GABA.
Did you SERIOUSLY have to do colouring in while working for that Nova place? My God ! Yep, I would be ashamed too !
Colouring in? My God, I would laugh, if I did could not imagine it being true. What else did you have to do? Empty out trash cans? Clean the toilets? My God alright !
Entertaining and poignant post, Canada Jin. Shit, no way could I believe its been a year.....those were the best of times, those were the worst of times. Bonded more in that fucked up time with a few of the co-strikers than I ever did when we used to get paid, over the cheapest of cheap shochu available, then did the fuckin call in the next day.
I never met Chari, but being a tit man myself, Im sure I, too, would love to give da beeyatch a good ol fashioned tittyfuck then give her the man milk all over her fascist Nova management face.....
Ahh, the memories .....
I actually miss all those sick calls
"So what's the reason you're not coming in......?"
"Ahmmmmm take a wild guess fuck knuckle!"
"OK I'll let your branch know"
That Kevin Spacey feeling was pretty exhilerating I have to say.
"You can't tell me what to do....ever again!"
I've wanted to be a teacher for many years. I have a lot of respect for good teachers and there is definitely a difference between good and mediocre. I was stationed in Japan for 3 years from ’03-’06 while I was in the Navy and have subsequently been fond of it. I have been studying the language periodically for years, but now I've gone full throttle since I've started college. Today I was browsing and read about English teachers in Japan and it led me here.
It breaks my heart seeing all this cynicism. You speak so lowly of yourselves and your goals in life. Watch the guy at the local McDonald's and see if he looks so self-deprecating. "I'm only taking orders for food, my job is meaningless" BAAAHHH. You're pathetic.
I must admit, I don't know anything about these teaching companies, but if they are to survive in a good market they need results. You might be worthless and loving it now, but a clinch in demand will wipe you away. There is honor in anything you do, if you believe in what you do. I have taken pride in some of my most mundane jobs in my life. I cannot believe an entire industry is made up of cynical self-loathing douche bags, just because "it's easy". There are a lot of easy jobs in the world, and if you think you have to go to Japan for sex and partying, you have more problems than solutions. Things are what you make them. If this entire industry is a mockery of education, then perhaps I could simply go to Japan and undercut you completely. If you truly are as worthless and disposable as some of you insist, I can tell you that the act of teaching English to any person is neither worthless nor disposable, and so I can replace you, and destroy you.
The cynicism you see on here is, imho, more due to good, hard working well intentioned people that have high standards that find themselves in something they would never intend to be associated with. Language schools (aka eikaiwa) tend to control what you teach, the materials you use, how long the lesson is, etc.. On top of that English at an eikaiwa is, to a degree, considered a 'leisure study', no real curriculum....pedagogy....or way to measure progress.
The largest language school in Japan (Nova) grew immense on three premises: #1 an English lesson should be priced about the same as a movie ticket because it has the same entertainment value #2 It's more important that you're sitting in a classroom with a foreigner than with a skilled teacher #3 Hearing and repeating a foreigner is *required* to unlock the part of your (Japanese) brain so that you can actually distinguish English from gibberish.
Does real education happen at language schools in Japan? sure it does
Does it happen often? No...
Do people work their asses off and do their best? most do...
Is the industry F*cked? most definitely
If you are seriously interested in education, and it's important to you that you're students benefit from your hard work, then stay out of eikaiwa - go with a MA in TEFL/ESL of some kind.
Ah, shut up with your broken heart bullshit, you stupid old twat ! Eikwaiwa is for LOSERS........END OF !
i made some of my bestest friends ever there though...so like university...you probably didnt NEED to go..but you would never miss it for the world.
cant imagine its the same gavin...i wont give last names...that would be something a cunt would do...if hes married to a Chari..and they act like they are better then everyone else, and she has big funbags...it might be the same lot..
but i think they ran home gto Oz and hid..and spent the last year trying to imagine what they would write on their CVs about this "strange period of time where you were out of the country..what EXACTLY were you doing?"
ah if there IS a God...every one of them cunts are begging for jobs they will never get....eating dog food, unshaven in their undershirts...waiting for Vodaphone to cut them off.
Youre one of the BEST ones..
Psst, hey, you, Mr. Broken Heart Guru. Guess what? No Guru's needed in here, so why don't you just put a cork in it, and piss off? Hmmm? Thanx.
Sorry, just to clarify - this is LETSJAPAN.ORG, and not LETSBOMBJAPAN.ORG.
"I've wanted to be a teacher for many years. I have a lot of respect for good teachers and there is definitely a difference between good and mediocre. I was stationed in Japan for 3 years from ’03-’06 while I was in the Navy"
Oh, Great. A lesson in morality from someone whose dream vocation in life was to be trained how to kill women and kids. THANKYOU!
"BAAAHHH. You're pathetic."
I know - thirty seven years old, and, in all that time, how many women and kids have I managed to Kill?.....NONE. God, I AM PATHETIC!!!!
"There is honor in anything you do, if you believe in what you do."
Even killing women and kids....
"I have taken pride in some of my most mundane jobs in my life..."
What, like NOT killing women and Kids? You mean, like just beating them, with a rifle butt?
"I cannot believe an entire industry is made up of cynical self-loathing douche bags, just because "it's easy". "
Unlike, say, the military....
"I can replace you, and destroy you"
I'm sure you can. Japanese schoolgirls and taxi drivers know that to be true, too.
Thankyou for the post. It's good to know one less person is carrying a weapon. Here, have MY job. Just stay away from the taxi drivers and schoolgirls, OK?
I did not agree with that poster myself. However, to call someone a baby killer because he was in the Navy??!! How totally childish. Please grow up.
"I did not agree with that poster myself. However, to call someone a baby killer because he was in the Navy??!! How totally childish. Please grow up."
Of course, butter wouldn't melt in their mouths...
I just did random Japan times search "US Navy Crimes Japan"
http://search.japantimes.co.jp/cgi-bin/nn20030730b7.html
http://search.japantimes.co.jp/cgi-bin/nn20080325i1.html
But couldn't find anything, by typing "Eikaiwa Douchebag"
Sorry
Oh, I see. Because some people in the Navy committed crimes (tens of thousands of them come to Japan every year), they are all baby killers?
So, are all eikaiwa teachers (and many would call them losers who do jobs that require no specialized training at all), baby killers because some eikaiwa teachers have committed crimes in Japan?? Or, do you think that eikaiwa teachers have never committed crimes in Japan????
If English teachers are all as dumb as you......
Im with Les Dawson here.
Im not going to defend the US Military in Japan with their history of shame. Go and ask any resident around the bases in Okinawa, etc what they think. They may not ALL be baby killers, but many do have a power trip just like the OP ("I can destroy you")
First of all, the crime rate of US military personal in Japan, even though they of a demographic group more prone to commit crimes, is actually LOWER than that of Japanese!! Do a Japan Times search.
http://search.japantimes.co.jp/cgi-bin/fl20080226zg.html
Secondly, crimes are committed by foreigners in Japan. For various reasons, the are not classified and reported as crimes committed by English teachers although I am sure some of them are. Regardless, since you are certainly a foreigner and foreigners in Japan commit crimes, by your OWN logic you are a baby killer!!!!!
http://search.japantimes.co.jp/cgi-bin/nn20061108a3.html
You my son are too dumb for words!
Les, I'm convinced you're a troll at this point. I haven't seen posts this asinine since Burley graced us with his presence...
You scream about the stereotyping of teaching jobs in Japan as not requiring specialized training only to reveal your double standards as you stereotype (ex) military persons as baby killers.
you tool, you troll....
guys, don't feed him anymore - this guy isn't legitimate.... no one this conflicted could actually use a computer.
g'night!
Your reality is what you make it.
I'm going to Tokyo in a couple months working for an eikaiwa (AEON). Do I expect working conditions to be ideal, the pay to be great and to have fluent students wal;king out by the end of their contract, no not really. I dont't have unreal expectations or rather I have a grasp on reality. I'm using AEON and they are using me. They use me for cheap disposable labor to hock their product and I use them to get me started in Japan with a subsidized apartment, setting up utilities and what not. Its a trade off. It seems from the research I've done most problems arise from people not using eikaiwas as a stepping stone.
I have my degree and work with children with behavioral problems who are living in group homes b/c they were removed from their parents/foster care homes due to sexual and physical abuse. A big part of my job is teaching and/or unlearning behaviors. You can be a teacher at heart w/o having a piece of paper that says "I'm a teacher". Pride and insecurities make people lash out at each other and say "You're not a real this and that I am b/c of (insert hoop jumping behavior that led to a piece of paper saying you successfully jumped through hoops for years)."
Just accept eikaiwas for what they are. Who cares why one person came to Japan or where they choose to work? Personally while I'm working at the eikaiwa I'll continue to learn the written language or at least attempt to, so that at the end of my year I can say tyvm for helping me get a foothold in Japan, and move on.
I personally think it's a good trade off. Give us a year and do your job. In return we'll set up your visa, a subsidized apartment, help you get adjusted and "learn the ropes" in a country you dont speak the language, a good reference at the end of your contract and a wage you can live on.
Like I said its all about your perception of reality.
That makes me a troll does it?
So if some arrogant jarhead comes on, tells it us like it is, and joins the long, long list of worthless arrogant fuckheads, who think they have the right to slag off eikaiwa teachers, sticking to crappy, and false stereotypes, in order to do it, and I give them a bit of their own medicine back - then I'M A TROLL. Right OK.
NovaWhiz and several others - you just don't see what I'm getting at. Eikaiwa teachers in the main are excellent, excellent people. But very very few people stick up for them - and if what I do makes me a troll, then yes, I'm a troll.
Les
PS NovaWhiz - you're a tit. It probably takes you three hours to get knock knock jokes.
You totally ran from the point. There are arrogant people in every field (as well as jerks that label people baby killers without any justification). Now, by your stupid logic, since you cannot deny English teachers in Japan commit crimes too, YOU ARE A BABY KILLER!
The fact remains that eikaiwa does not require any special skills or training and even a total idiot like you can do it!
Another irony challenged nitwit on my case. Woo hoo.
Sorry, can't even be bothered responding.
Except to say you too are a tit.
You are as stupid as you are fun to mess with baby killer!
Again, by your own juvenile logic, that is what you are. Is that all the logic and intelligence teaching English requires??
You are an AOEN / EX NOVA troll, reality.
I saw this exact same story, slightly different wording, posted in NTU, when Nova was alive and kicking, and of course, it was a Nova recruitment troll.
Once again, initially, no-one dared question the legitimacy of the poster, because they had established their credibility with the same claim, that being they worked with children who were victims of “sexual and physical abuse”. How could anyone question such a person? Don't even dare !
Seems like AEON has got one of the ex Nova stooges on their crew.
Troll
If you had a run in with jar-head that made you feel bad, it definitely shows.
You're exerting a tremendous amount of energy shadow boxing and I don't think the fine people who work hard despite eikaiwa schools being a sham need you to step in for them.
"Just accept eikaiwas for what they are. Who cares why one person came to Japan or where they choose to work? Personally while I'm working at the eikaiwa I'll continue to learn the written language or at least attempt to, so that at the end of my year I can say tyvm for helping me get a foothold in Japan, and move on."
Very crafty, the whole "Just accept eikaiwas for what they are" is the real giveaway. Try to ignore the glaring scam going on right in front of you?. See them trying to sell an expensive package to a mentally deficient person? It's just business? You wouldn't be able to get a foot in the door here without eikaiwa?
Eikaiwa never try to justify their existence, but they sure do try to make it look like they are the ones being taken advantage of. Honestly, I think they are pretty effective at pulling the wool over a great many eyes.
It is very quiet in here. I guess with the world in such a state of
turmoil, pink bunnies are the least of people's worries.
I have grave fears for the Japanese economy, since there is such a
heavy reliance in Japan, on healthy demand in the United States.
I think that unemployment in Japan will skyrocket over the short to
medium term, and households and companies will tighten their
expenditure belts enormously, putting enormous pressure on the
eikaiwa language circus sector, especially for schools that really
don't offer a genuine educational product and charge a fortune for
it, and when you get to the bottom of their lurks and perks sales
bullshit, that pretty much covers all eikaiwa schools.
The Chinese government must be having an ideological laugh, because
the Free World is resulting to socialist means and methods to prop up
their "free market" economies.
But how much more can the American Federal Reserve handle?
Conservative estimates are that the United States tax payer will be
footing the bill for the current mess for at least the next quarter
of a century, and yet, many argue, the worst is yet to come.
Is the United States irreversibly bankrupt? Many argue, YES, it is.
One thing is for sure, we are witnessing an historic restructuring of
world order taking place, with the United States presently lost in
the wilderness, and floundering in its efforts to regroup and find
direction.
There are arguments that it is all the fault of George Bush and the
Republicans (let's face it, he is the biggest buffoon of a president
in the history of the United States), and don't forget, his would be
Republican successor openly admits, his knowledge of economics is
also very much elementary.
However, the balance of power in the United States is a shared
situation, with the President himself being a lot less powerful than
most people realise.
The President effectively shares or presides over power WITH the
United States Congress (the two chambers of the Congress being The
Senate, and The House of Representatives), and who holds the balance
of power in both?
In fact, legislative power itself is vested in the two chambers of
Congress, and not simply with the President himself.
While I would like to see the Republicans blown into oblivion by an
historic landslide electoral defeat, a change in the political
balance of power in the USA is probably going to do nothing to help
the United States economy right here, right now.
I do think the Democrats, however, will stand a better chance of
efficiently and time effectively coming up with solutions, without a
nincompoop Republican President residing over the mess.
What is happening now has been argued as being what the perpetrators
of 9 11 specifically targeted, and certainly, the reaction of George
Bush to 9 11 was a dream come true for the terrorists, many
intellectual analysts put forward.
Now, more than ever, the United States cannot afford to fit the bill
for futile armed combats that cannot be won by force, no matter how
atrocious the mass murder of innocent civilians that took place on 9
11 was.
America needs to take a totally new course, if it is ever to emerge
from this chaos.
Eikaiwa will never change for two reasons. The market requires a lot of teachers and conversational lessons need to be one-on-one or in small classes so quality is expensive on a per-customer basis. The teaching workforce is largely transient, very few people want to teach long-term so they don't want to invest in qualifications and it's not cost effective for the company to invest much in training.
These circumstances and basic economics determine the quality of the product more than anything. There isn't really 'a scam' happening here, dodgy sales practises simply evolve naturally as a result of the nature of the product and customers, management pressure and all the factors mentioned above.
All this is so obvious but people seem to think that if they rant on long enough here eikaiwa will somehow be majically reformed.
Thankyou for disagreeing with me - it makes me feel like I'm definitely on the right track.
If I am so pathetic, why bother replying? I'll tell you - because you are way too dim, to work it out for yourself.
It's because you are a drivelling halfwit with an ego problem. You'll obviously get to have the last say, because the boredom is really getting to me. But I've dusted you, and your halfwit ilk. Game over. Goodbye forever.
Les
Thankyou for disagreeing with me - it makes me feel like I'm definitely on the right track.
If I am so pathetic, why bother replying? I'll tell you - because you are way too dim, to work it out for yourself.
It's because you are a drivelling halfwit with an ego problem. You'll obviously get to have the last say, because the boredom is really getting to me. But I've dusted you, and your halfwit ilk. Game over. Goodbye forever.
Les
I know what your problem is Les. You are stuck in eikaiwa, and have no options is life, cause it's all you know, and all you can do. Life over, while you still have your hair. I tell you what, shut the hell up, get back into your booth, and deliver your 400th pizza lesson, you boo-hooing, cry baby, masturbate behind the locker rooms, sniff underpants on the clothes-line, monkey stool retard.
You know alot about the lifestyles of those loathsome Eikaiwa teachers, don't you, Kikuchiyo 菊千代 ??? !!!
The dirty little post regarding Les. Am pretty sure it is a guy who calls himself Mackorello, who frequents NTU, and got himself into a mess, by posting over and over again the same masturbation stuff, and recently, has been posting links to adults only masturbation sites. He claims to be a high school teacher in Japan. Yeah, got me sctratching my head too, with regards to the screening the Japanese employers actually do. NIL, it woul appear.
"I personally think it's a good trade off. Give us a year and do your job. In return we'll set up your visa, a subsidized apartment"
Can anyone verify that ANY Eikaiwa Subsidizes Apartments?
I was at NOVA, which on Average charged 70,000 PCM to each teacher (Usually 3 teachers per apartment, so Nova took 210,000PCM) on an apartment NOVA paid aboout 70,000 PCM on - so there was no subsidy. And, from What I've heard, Shane is WORSE. What about the other Schools?
What the hell are you doing, posting an intelligent post with factual data?! Don't you know there is a sniping troll flame war going on here! ;-) The US (and I'm an American) can't handle that its significance is diminishing and they are losing their power on the world stage. The 700 [s]m[/s]billion dollar bailout is off the Richter scale in terms of 'crisis mode'. Japan's problems economically will also only intensify and disposable income (for eikaiwa and other things) will continue to tighten.
Now I read that McCain wants to postpone the televised debate to "tend to this massive problem". Or he is scared shitless by the prospect of being exposed as someone who has NO business governing the US.
anyone else..still here in japan ...get a form that told you you would be entitled to a tax adjustment? (presumably cuz we didnt work for Nova Scum for the last 3 months of the year)
i am just curious to know if anyone has bothered to take it to their ward office...and if its worth my time..
what kind of rebate are we talking here?
thanks
Has anyone read this article in today's paper?
http://search.japantimes.co.jp/cgi-bin/fl20080930zg.html
It's interesting because I recently interviewed with Berlitz in Tokyo and they mentioned nothing about the strike. Do Berlitz instructors check this site?
Yeah, I have come across that jerk Mackorello. The guy needs a bullet in his head. Some joker recently reported him to yahoo, and about time. I have never come across such an insipid little goose before in my life. Talk about a pain in the ass !
thats a crap salary I m afraid, when one considers the 400 000 yen insurance a year you now MUST pay to get a visa next year, the 400 000 city tax, and the high cost of rent.
In Korea teachers dont pay rent, though its even less gaijin friendly than Japan, a lot less actually.
In Japan you pay to play.
news is now the insurance will not tied to the visa after all...
so we can continue to whistle past the graveyard for 3 more years!
tra-la-la!
Add new comment